I just don't see Miller getting it. It will probably end up another Frank Miller story (which I am pretty sick of I have to admit) with the names from the comics ...
Truth to tell, I never really "got" Miller. He goes in the category of "important to the genre, but I'll never understand why", along with Tolkien and Heinlein. My concern is that he'll capture all of Eisner's grit and none of the charm...
That is absolutely the problem as I see it. Miller's big contribution to American comics is the introduction of a film-noir violence unlike anything seen in the mainstream stuff to that point. I have problems when he takes it over the top, because he becomes a self-parody. But when he's on, I feel the only creator who can match his chops is Matt Wagner... and Wagner does have the charm.
Precisely. Eeugh. Before All Star Batman and Robin, I would've been less worried, even with the evidence of The Dark Knight Strikes Again and Sin City, because they're pretty much Miller's universes. But ASB&R was ostensibly canon-ish. And it was pathetically, nastily bad.
One can only imagine Grant Morrison or Peter David's take on The Spirit... ;)
Anyway, yes. Part of what makes The Spirit work is that whirl from gritty reality to sheer lunacy--all of it done noir, of course, but with the right touch--say, Will Eisner's, for example--even noir can be goofy.
I'd feel better about the project if someone with proven chops on the lighter side were involved. To really work, this movie doesn't have to be dark. It has to be pulpy.
Yeah, after I posted, I thought about that... I pretty much stopped reading comics almost ten years ago (which means I'm due to start again, it's cyclical that way) and PAD was one of my favorite writers then. Maybe Miller and David can co-write. :)
I can see Miller getting the visual style and the "grit" part of it, but the humor? The irony? However, before we give up all hope, remember this is Hollywood here. As far as we know Miller might end up only doodling a few set designs, they could be just using him now to get more attention in the media.
As usual, I'm going to hope for the best, expect the worst, and not form any opinions until I see the trailer or hear some insider information.
Heh. It took me a long time to appreciate at it. But Flash Gordon (http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0080745/) is one of the absolute best bad movies of all time. Even if the leads were awful.
I've read just enough of The Spirit to say that while the world some of the stories take place in are pretty dark, the characters are not at all dark. Miller, whatever his strengths, seems to like dark or violent heroes, and that is not and never will be Denny Colt.
That said, I also think that the Spirit is a man of his times, and we might be much better served with a film that takes place in the 40s. Alas, we are about to get not just this film but a DC comic by Darwyn Cooke that moves the Spirit to the present as well. This is what we are stuck with.
Oh, and it's worth noting that this film was initally being written by comic book and TV writer Jeph Loeb, a project he dropped when his son died of cancer. Loeb has done good work with classic heroes like Supes and Spidey, so we are left wondering what may have been.
Your response prompted me to really think about why I'm so trepidacious (and now, for sure, I am) about Miller doing it. We've been dancing all around it all thread, but it's actually one simple, obvious word.
Heart.
Think of Denny's relationships with Ellen... Sand Serif... Silk Satin... even P'Gell. Think of his friendship -- his real, deep friendship -- with Ebony White. Think of Gerhard Shnobble, the man who could fly. Think of "What's Ten Minutes In A Man's Life?"
There was something pointed out about Wally Wood's otherwise sterling art on The Outer Space Spirit: Unlike Eisner, Wood's characters never much made eye contact. In Eisner's Spirit, the eye contact, the human contact, was every bit as important as it was in Carl Barks' Duck books.
Eisner was a consummate storyteller, which meant that his stories grew naturally out of his characters. Miller is a very good writer, but he works best iconically -- Stick, Stone, Axe, Elektra, The Dark Knight, Marv, etc., etc., etc. I don't think he's got the sense of whimsy, or the sense of how human relationships work, to pull this off.
I remember (vaguely) a TV-movie version of THE SPIRIT that was made sometime in the early to mid-1980s. As I recall, it went toward the whimsical side, but it has been so long since I've seen it that I don't remember if it went over the line with the whimsy or not. I suspect that Miller's version will try to be as much of a polar opposite to that version as he can possibly make it.
As I said, I couldn't remember if it went too far over the line with the whimsy or not. It might be that it's an individual judgement call. I still think I would rather have it too campy than too Frank Miller.
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With cautious optimism, Susan.
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There is a gentleness, a sense of irony that I just can't see Miller dealing with. Subtlety is something that Miller just doesn't do.
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He could've said "I'm the Juggernaut, bitch!"
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Anyway, yes. Part of what makes The Spirit work is that whirl from gritty reality to sheer lunacy--all of it done noir, of course, but with the right touch--say, Will Eisner's, for example--even noir can be goofy.
I'd feel better about the project if someone with proven chops on the lighter side were involved. To really work, this movie doesn't have to be dark. It has to be pulpy.
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Actually, I think PAD would do great with it - have you read his Fallen Angel series (both the DC run and the current IDW series)?
Grant Morrison, OTOH...somehow a post-modern, self-aware, surrealistic version of Denny Colt & Co. just doesn't make me all warm and fuzzy inside :)
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That is all.
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As usual, I'm going to hope for the best, expect the worst, and not form any opinions until I see the trailer or hear some insider information.
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ahhh ... don't get me started ...
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Sam Jones may be as good an actor as Buster though ...
see ... ya got me started. I have to watch Flash Gordon (the real one) tonight
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That said, I also think that the Spirit is a man of his times, and we might be much better served with a film that takes place in the 40s. Alas, we are about to get not just this film but a DC comic by Darwyn Cooke that moves the Spirit to the present as well. This is what we are stuck with.
Oh, and it's worth noting that this film was initally being written by comic book and TV writer Jeph Loeb, a project he dropped when his son died of cancer. Loeb has done good work with classic heroes like Supes and Spidey, so we are left wondering what may have been.
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Heart.
Think of Denny's relationships with Ellen... Sand Serif... Silk Satin... even P'Gell. Think of his friendship -- his real, deep friendship -- with Ebony White. Think of Gerhard Shnobble, the man who could fly. Think of "What's Ten Minutes In A Man's Life?"
There was something pointed out about Wally Wood's otherwise sterling art on The Outer Space Spirit: Unlike Eisner, Wood's characters never much made eye contact. In Eisner's Spirit, the eye contact, the human contact, was every bit as important as it was in Carl Barks' Duck books.
Eisner was a consummate storyteller, which meant that his stories grew naturally out of his characters. Miller is a very good writer, but he works best iconically -- Stick, Stone, Axe, Elektra, The Dark Knight, Marv, etc., etc., etc. I don't think he's got the sense of whimsy, or the sense of how human relationships work, to pull this off.
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