Ummm....

[filkertom]

In case you didn't figure it out, the question I asked in the last thread -- how would you convince our friends to leave Texas in case it secedes -- was facetious. I don't want Texas to secede, it's against the law for it to secede, and I'm quite sure most of our friends there are quite happy.

This does not mean the state doesn't need some work:

Bill Nye, the harmless children's edu-tainer known as "The Science Guy," managed to offend a select group of adults in Waco, Texas at a presentation, when he suggested that the moon does not emit light, but instead reflects the light of the sun.

...

... [N]othing got people as riled as when he brought up Genesis 1:16, which reads: "God made two great lights -- the greater light to govern the day and the lesser light to govern the night. He also made the stars."

The lesser light, he pointed out, is not a light at all, but only a reflector.

At this point, several people in the audience stormed out in fury. One woman yelled "We believe in God!" and left with three children....

Now, in fairness, this happened three years ago (thanks to hughcasey for noticing what I did not). I'm sure things have gotten much better since.

Original story here, with a hat tip to admnaismith.

Comments

[morpheus0013.livejournal.com]

I can MAYBE see disbelieving evolution and beliving stringent creationism. MAYBE.

But not believing that the moon reflects light? HOW CAN YOU NOT BELIEVE THAT?!

[biomekanic.livejournal.com]

There are plenty of people who still believe the world is flat.

There are plenty of people who don't know that a year means the Earth has gone around the Sun once.

There are plenty of people who still believe that the Sun goes around the Earth.

Not knowing that that moonlight is reflected sunlight? So not surprising.

[pandoradeloeste.livejournal.com]

Awww, why would anyone boo Bill Nye the Science Guy? He's funny and has awesome bow ties (and apparently can lindy hop with the best of them). :-(

(One of these days I am gonna teach myself to read Torah so that I can read the original text and show up some of these nimrods. I'll bet the original Hebrew has tons of nuance that get lost in translation, nuances that are probably perfectly consistent with scientific concepts like non-geocentric universes and light reflecting off surfaces.)

[mimiheart.livejournal.com]

Well, you can learn Hebrew and Torah with vowels first, then learn grammar to read Torah without vowels. Unless I'm reading Torah at a service, I always read it with vowels to make sure I'm pronouncing it correctly--and I read it multiple times a day for various reasons.

[mimiheart.livejournal.com]

Replying to your edit...

The mistranslation begins with the first word. "B'reshit" doesn't translate as "In the beginning" it would mean "in a beginning" or as some translate now, "When G-d began creating..."

When you take away the word "the" (which isn't in the Hebrew) you open up all sorts of possibilities. How many beginnings are there? How many worlds? How many do-overs did G-d get on this planet?

[batyatoon]

Mmm ... while the original Hebrew does have quite a great deal of nuance that gets lost in translation, if taken literally it will still run you right up against contradictions of scientific concepts.

What you might want is to take a look at the oral tradition. Wherein it's made pretty clear that the Genesis account is not to be taken literally. (*wry* Which helps a lot when one is trying to reconcile one's faith and one's intellectual honesty.)

[mimiheart.livejournal.com]

I believe in G-d. I also believe in science. I don't think that one negates the other. Believing Bereshit (the Hebrew name for Genesis) doesn't mean that you have to believe in it literally and that the light from the moon HAS to originate from the moon. If you believe in the the story as written, there was light before there was a source FOR the light. (Not going there right now.)

People, it's okay to think.

[pandoradeloeste.livejournal.com]

This is one of the cool things about Judaism that I don't see in Christianity (at least the way it's practiced by most people) - Jews, even Orthodox ones (AFAIK), engage with the text and find room for science in it. Nobody ever hears about Orthodox Jews storming out of science lectures screaming that they believe in G-d, because for the most part they use their frakking heads.

[peachtales.livejournal.com]

Tom, you don't understand, see, the Sun and all the other bodies in our system (the Solar system, no less) orbit the Earth. :P

[filkertom.livejournal.com]

I see. And where does the turtle fit in?

(Yes, yes, I know. Turtles all the way down.)

I pulled out

[sffilk.livejournal.com]

the more modernistic orthodox of my Hebrew Bibles, and here's what it says:

1:16 "And G-D made the two great luminaries, the greater luminary to dominate the day and the lesser luminary to dominate the night; and the stars."

The commentary says: "'Great' cannot refer literally to size, for the stars are larger than the moon. Rather, the luminaries are described as great in relation to the visible intensity of their illumination. Since the moon is closer to the earth than the stars, its light is stronger than theirs (Radak; Malbim).

Re: I pulled out

[filkertom.livejournal.com]

Now, y'see, I'm used to "luminaries" being paper bags with lit candles that you put on the sidewalk on holidays.

That's one big honkin' paper bag.

Re: I pulled out

[skemono.livejournal.com]

The commentary says: "'Great' cannot refer literally to size, for the stars are larger than the moon.

...yeah. I'm sure the people who wrote that knew that at the time.

[hughcasey.livejournal.com]

Tom, this story is over three years old. It happened in 2006. Check the date on the original article.

[filkertom.livejournal.com]

[facepalm] Didn't even notice. For that matter, the blog post admnaismith linked to was back in February. Noted and logged above -- thanks, Hugh!

[jenk]

I doubt people would have been upset at all if Nye hadn't brought up Genesis 1:16.

[pandoradeloeste.livejournal.com]

That does seem calculated to rub some people the wrong way, doesn't it?

[pagawne.livejournal.com]

As a true Texan I can say that Texas also has some of the dumbest people in the world, as well as some of the brightest.

[mythdude.livejournal.com]

That's just dumb, especially when you consider the majority of the moon is made up of rocks, which aren't the best medium for producing light. They aren't even second best, or third best.

...now if you were to split rock atoms somehow, THEN you'd get light. And plenty of it! :P

[dornbeast.livejournal.com]

That's just dumb, especially when you consider the majority of the moon is made up of rocks, which aren't the best medium for producing light.

(Lie Mode: ON)
But the moon landings were all faked in a studio in Hollywood, everybody knows that!
(Lie Mode: OFF)

[misterseth.livejournal.com]

Devo was right. We're ALL devolved! (At least Texas is anyway!)

[wildcard9.livejournal.com]

When will these bilble thumps remember that the Book of Genesis is MYTH, not history. The other four books of the old testiment are supposed to be history, and even some of that stuff looks very suspicious to me.

[saganth.livejournal.com]

You'd have thought that those people who "BELIEVE IN GOD!!!" would not have bothered to attend any talk given by someone known as "the science guy." Now, if he was "Bill Nye The Fundie Guy" they'd have been right at home...

It's not just that they're blindly fundamental. They're stupid too. I'm sorry if that offends anyone, but there's no nice way to put it. Frequently, religious fanaticism and ignorance/stupidity go hand in hand.

[mathmuffin.livejournal.com]

The full Genesis 1:16 Bible verse is:
God made two great lights—-the greater light to govern the day and the lesser light to govern the night. He also made the stars.

<sarcasm> So whenever we see the moon out in the daytime rather than the nighttime, it is a violation of God's law!</sarcasm>

I hope that my absurdity above makes clear that that verse is more poetic than literal. It isn't describing the exact nature of the world's two primary sources of illumination, it's describing their roles in human life. The moon, when it is out at night, helps people see and is the most significant point of reference in the sky at night.

A skylight is called a light even though it only passes sunlight. So the moon can be called a light even though it only reflects sunlight.

[shockwave77598.livejournal.com]

This is why these goobers are trying to destroy science in the US.

G & S

[janedit.livejournal.com]

Geez--even Gilbert and Sullivan got it right in the 1800s! (In The Mikado, Act II, "The Sun and I," referring to the moon:)

She borrows light that through the night mankind may all acclaim her/And truth to tell she lights up well, so I for one don't blame her.

Re: G & S

[r-caton.livejournal.com]

Cunning devils, these fiendish young ladies of Japan.....

But she had attended a ladies seminary run by a genius tutelary so she had to have some brains....

Is it illegal?

[lindaneely.livejournal.com]

I seem to remember back in the paleolithic, when I studied American History, that Texas came into the union via treaty and was the only state that could legally separate from the union. Did that change?

Re: Is it illegal?

[dan-ad-nauseam.livejournal.com]

No, it can't legally secede, but the annexation treaty allows it to subdivide into five states.