They Cannot Brain, They Have The Dumb

[filkertom]

All of the Republican leaders and punditry and a whole bunch of misinformed, lied-to people are railing against the Dreaded Public Option, the notion of government-run health care (which is not actually government-run health care, but a way for the government to pay for health care rather than the usurious^3 rates we pay for private insurance now, if they don't decline or cancel it out from under us). It will cost too much to have some competition for the private sector, which functions marvelously under the Glorious Free Market unless they are up against something not-for-profit, in which case they are helpless and in imminent danger of losing their big-ass bonuses.

Meanwhile, the H1N1 (Swine Flu) shots start in October. Not administered by the private sector. Publicly financed, in fact.

How is that not government-run health care, guys? And why aren't any of you saying Boo about that?

Just sayin'.

Comments

[sethb]

You haven't seen the nutcases who plan to refuse the H1N1 shots because they're a government conspiracy to infect them with something-or-other?

Why don't you move to Toronto

[urban-terrorist.livejournal.com]

We have excellent health care here, and we'd love to have you.

Re: Why don't you move to Toronto

[lizziecrowe.livejournal.com]

Vancouver IS so lovely....

Re: Why don't you move to Toronto

[smittythesmith.livejournal.com]

Yeah, when I go out into the woods it reminds me of Chulak in the spring.

[solarbird]

Actually there is a refusal meme going in rightist circles of this specific vaccine. That'll be fun.

[redaxe.livejournal.com]

Dare we hope that there might be some self-correction there? (Not deaths, please gods. But changes in attitude after some unhappy illness, among those still capable of changing their minds.)

[lovefromgirl.livejournal.com]

Funny, because there are extreme leftists refusing the vaccine because it's a vaccine.

Someday, I will smack all of these people in the face with a wet fish.

[solarbird]

One fork of the rightest rejectionist meme is because it's a plot of the Obama administration to poison Real Americans. This has (purely anecdotally) appeared to be the smaller fork.

[siliconshaman.livejournal.com]

Oh please let this idea catch on...and H1N1 turn out to lots more nasty than people expected.

Let Darwin collect his dues.

[kengr]

Lets not. *I* would likely be one of the victims. Because I have health issues and no medical coverage (but because *in theory* my assets are worth too much, I don't qualify for free care).

[zellion.livejournal.com]

but a way for the government to pay for health care rather than the usurious rates we pay for private insurance now, if they don't decline or cancel it out from under us).


Funny you should mention that last part. Feministing.com has this link up today as part of their roundup. I didn't know there was a healthreform.gov site, but this page discusses the epidemic of the pre-existing condition racket.

"It is still legal in nine states for insurers to reject applicants who are survivors of domestic violence, citing the history of domestic violence as a pre-existing condition." (http://www.healthreform.gov/reports/denied_coverage/index.html)

[shaharazad.livejournal.com]

I'm actually hearing a lot of "don't trust the government's vaccine" talk from conservatives. So, yeah, at least some of them are saying "Boo" to it.

[emiofbrie.livejournal.com]

I hear it from the libertarian sector too, actually... it's not just the right-wing, and they were just as much against it when Bush's cronies were talking up the H1N1 vaccine too last year. This vaccine's been in the works for the last 2 years, actually.

[gorgeousgary]

WTF? Am I going to have to start avoiding Republicans and Libertarians until my turn for a vaccine comes up?

[emiofbrie.livejournal.com]

The problem is that the vaccine was rushed through testing, and the testing wasn't very thorough, and a lot of people haven't forgotten what happened the last time we had a Swine Flu vaccine (1976)

[jenrose]

I and my older daughter are allergic to eggs, my younger daughter has idiosyncratic reactions to *everything* due to her chromosome disorder. DD1 has had horrible reactions to vaccines in the past, we're not going to be in the first wave regardless until there is some sense of the side effects.

Anyway, I fully expect us to all get H1N1 in September, my teen just started back to school, and her sister starts next week.

[jerusha.livejournal.com]

Yes and no. They're making the vaccine against this novel strain of H1N1 (which is not the same as the 1976 Swine Flu) using the same processes as the regular, seasonal influenza vaccine. No, influenza vaccines aren't tested to the same standards as other vaccines - because those standards require multi-year testing, but influenza vaccine must be reformulated each year to match the (expected) upcoming strains of influenza. Unlike polio or measles, which are relatively stable, influenza undergoes antigenic drift and antigenic shift, which is why last year's shot (probably) won't protect you against this year's flu.

See Science-Based Medicine for details; they do a lot of work regarding vaccines and anti-vaccine hysteria, and have a very nice set of posts about influenza

[admnaismith.livejournal.com]

Could be the makings of a mass Darwin Award here.

[jrittenhouse.livejournal.com]

Yepper.

[gorgeousgary]

Problem is, how many of the rest of us are they going to make sick?

Especially since I'm not even in Round 1 for the vaccinations. I might even be Round 3.

[smparadox.livejournal.com]

Depends on how many of the rest of us have impaired immune systems. I am not going to bother getting the vaccine, simply because there are other people who actually need it. By the time there is enough for everyone, odds are I will have had H1N1 and been done with it already anyway, especially since my wife works in an elementary school...

[gorgeousgary]

I work in a building with 400 people, commute on an overcrowded subway, attend a medieval dance practice two blocks from a large university, and have to spend the last week of October (when I'd rather be at OVFF) cooped up in a hotel ballroom with two thousand building officials and other construction industry folks.

I can't *afford* to get sick until at least November...

[smparadox.livejournal.com]

With all of that exposure to people, good luck! (I don't mean that sarcastically either - you'll need luck.)

[umbran.livejournal.com]

(which is not actually government-run health care, but a way for the government to pay for health care rather than the usurious^3 rates we pay for private insurance now, if they don't decline or cancel it out from under us)

If I may, that is not exactly correct.

The "public option" is not "government pay for". It is paid for as any other health insurance - with the insured paying premiums. There is no tax subsidy. It is as if the government happened to own a health insurance agency.

[lovefromgirl.livejournal.com]

But won't be allowed to jack up the rates, can't refuse anyone on grounds of "pre-existing conditions" (what a joke; most adults have something!), and will keep me from dying of a toothache?

Don't know about you, but that's still better than the status quo.

[filkertom.livejournal.com]

True, but there is a mechanism for people who can't afford it to be subsidized. Here's FactCheck.org's overview of Obama's speech (http://www.factcheck.org/2009/09/obamas-health-care-speech/), and a good overview of the whole situation by Robert Reich (http://robertreich.blogspot.com/2009/09/final-sprint-for-health-care-has-now.html).

[umbran.livejournal.com]

Yes, there is such a mechanism, but that's only one point in a much larger beast. The Public Option is not about having the government peya for your health care.

It pays us a lot to keep the concepts clear, separate and straight. Failing to do so is part of the Democrat's big problem these days. So, let us not add to the difficulty. If we mix things up, we cannot discuss the various ideas cogently with the loyal opposition.

[liddle-oldman.livejournal.com]

None of their puppetmasters have told them to protest it?

[patoadam]

Another thing they don't tell you is that 97% of the money Medicare (which is, of course, public health insurance) spends goes to pay medical bills, compared to only 80% for private health insurance. My congressman, conservative Republican Tom McClintock, says that the government can't possibly provide inexpensive health insurance because they once bought some $400 hammers. This is a classic case of preferring irrelevant to relevant evidence.

[caraig.livejournal.com]

At the place I work at -- let's call it $COLLEGE -- there was an email forwarded to the entire staff and faculty about how the H1N1 swine flu vaccine was an Illuminati conspiracy to kill off a third of the nation so that Europe and the United Nations could come in and take over.

I am not making this shit up. That is exactly what it said in a nutshell.

I actually wasn't planning on getting the vaccine. I have some issues with vaccination in general. But seeing how this is developing -- and also that I should take my fellow human beings into consideration, and this is not like the usual influenza -- it will, I think, behoove me to get vaccinated.

And if it IS an Illuminati conspiracy ("Velkommen to Bavaria! Everybody DANSE!" Tom, I love that song. =) ) well, I figure I have even odds -- I'm not in the best of health -- of either: (a) dying and avoiding the worst of the clash between the militias, dominionists, and Jack Bauer versus the UN Black Helicopter Squadrons and European Unification Legions; or (b) surviving under socialized health care. =)

Yes, for the humor impaired, I'm being facetious.

[rmeidaking.livejournal.com]

Yeah, don't bring up the VA or Medicare, either...

[ladyskada.livejournal.com]

I think the line that said it all was:

"Keep your government hands off of my Medicare!"

*headdesk*

[smittythesmith.livejournal.com]

Ok, Boo. Prolly every one of those swine flu shots will have Thiomersal (mercury) in them. For those who don't know about Thiomersal, it's a dumbening (is that a word?) neurotoxin that is used as a preservative in vaccines.
Tho as far as the public option :)

But either way our health care system in this country seems to want to pump mercury into us. X-(

[banjoplayinnerd.livejournal.com]

Well, that could explain why some of us are as mad as hatters . . .

[smittythesmith.livejournal.com]

yep, hat-makers is Briton used to use mercury to stiffen the brims of felt hats. So that's where Alice in Wonderland's mad hatter came from.

[marsdejahthoris.livejournal.com]

Thiomersal hasn't been used as a preservative in vaccines since the '70's.

I love ignorance! :-P

[smittythesmith.livejournal.com]

No research eh? http://www.vaccinesafety.edu/thi-table.htm
http://www.vaccineinformation.org/thimerosal.asp

Still in use. My grandma almost died from a chickenpox vaccine that contained Thimerosal, in the 90's.

Re: I love ignorance! :-P

[marsdejahthoris.livejournal.com]

I stand corrected, the sources I used for research were in error.

[smittythesmith.livejournal.com]

As it turns out there is a thiomersal-free option. It seems that single-use vaccines don't need preservatives.