The Evil Fucks Never Stop, Part 2

[filkertom]

This may become an ongoing feature. Just when you think Chimpy cannot possibly be any more appalling:

At a private reception held at the White House with newly elected lawmakers shortly after the election, Bush asked Webb how his son, a Marine lance corporal serving in Iraq, was doing.

Webb responded that he really wanted to see his son brought back home, said a person who heard about the exchange from Webb.

“I didn’t ask you that, I asked how he’s doing,” Bush retorted, according to the source.

Webb confessed that he was so angered by this that he was tempted to slug the commander-in-chief, reported the source, but of course didn’t. It’s safe to say, however, that Bush and Webb won’t be taking any overseas trips together anytime soon.

What kind of human being says something like that to the father of a soldier?

Comments

[vixyish.livejournal.com]

One who, as I've been pretty certain about him for years now, doesn't give a fuck about anybody else.

I think that's really it. Stupid, maybe. Evil... I don't know. He just does not. Give. A fuck. About this country or any of its people.

[jrittenhouse.livejournal.com]

Um, yeah. Pretty much.

[redaxe.livejournal.com]

The sort who has never ever had to care about anyone else, or even fake it well. The sort who has the soul of a cockroach.

In short, the sort who have been running the country for six years, and who are going to be facing the light soon now (I hope and pray).

[cktraveler.livejournal.com]

Someone so solipsistic that he is incapable of empathy -- incapable of understanding that anybody but himself really exists, let alone is capable of emotions and desires separate from his own.

In short, a sociopath.

[kightp.livejournal.com]

On the bright side, take that, Mr. President...

[vettecat.livejournal.com]

Human being?

[filkertom.livejournal.com]

Well, precisely.

[scruffycritter.livejournal.com]

Given Webb is going to be my Senator (and I did vote for him) I read it like this:

I'm appalled too, but not for the reason Webb was (nor anyone else I suspect).

Dubya was trying to make small-talk and Webb pivoted it to politics. Dubya is probably sick of this. And yeah, it's in real bad form. But he's got standards he needs to live up to to and so El Presidente can just suck it up and deal. I don't blame Dubya a bit for being annoyed with Webb for doing that. Webb made the first faux pas there, but that in no way justifies what Dubya did in response.

Nobody Elected him Emily Post. Nobody elected him Judith Martin. This is like when he went off on a PressCorp member's choice of tie.

W's response should have been, "Wish we could do that but we need him there. But as I was asking, how's he doing?"

[trdsf.livejournal.com]

I can't fault Webb at all. It's a hell of a question for an AWOL chickenhawk like Dumbass to ask of someone who is quite naturally scared spitless for his son's safety, particularly when said AWOL chickenhawk is the one who put his son in harm's way in the first place--and without good cause. There's nothing political in Webb's response, if all he said was that he wants him home. Of course he wants him home. Every parent with a son or daughter over there wants them home. That's not politicizing, that's being a dad. It's not like Webb said "Well, he'd be a whole lot better if you hadn't lied him into being there in the first place." That would be politicizing it, and in any report I've seen so far, all Webb said was that he wanted his son home. If anyone politicized it, it was the Commander-In-Thief by his reaction.

[twfarlan.livejournal.com]

I didn't read Webb's response as political. I read it as a father wanting his son not to die. (shrug)

[hitchkitty.livejournal.com]

Well, in all fairness, every conversation with the President of the United States is political.

(Hell, even discussing the weather with him reminds people he's had difficulty recognizing clouds.)

So I find the above apology for Bush more than a little false. As part of his office, Bush cannot have apolitical conversations. He cannot make small talk.

[twfarlan.livejournal.com]

There are few people who are more disgusted than I am by Shrub. That being said, I don't agree with you that the guy can't have any conversations just because he's the president. I also don't accept his answer. It was rudely phrased and shows a distinct lack of empathy for a father who honestly doesn't KNOW how his son is doing, but knows that he'd be doing better if he wasn't off in a foreign land in the middle of their civil war, one that this country started.

[scruffycritter.livejournal.com]

The Washington Post quoted Webb as saying, "We want them home". (italics are mine).

I don't know how that isn't a political pivot.

The article (in today's edition) also has Webb making it plain that he doesn't like Bush, doesn't want diddly from him etc, tried to avoid him during the event. and thinks, well, basically what we do about him, which is all well and good...

But when the President found him, asked the above, and followed up with , "I didn't ask you that. How's your boy?", Webb responded, "That's between him and me" and then went on to tell the Post, "...But I look forward to working with him"...

I gotta ask who's Webb trying to kid?

Webb doesn't like the guy. He dissed the guy. Go Webb.

But making Bush out to be the guy to be the only attitude here is wholly inaccurate.

[trdsf.livejournal.com]

This is the first report I've seen that he said we wanted them home rather than him. It changes things, but honestly, I don't think it changes them all that much. We already know that The Liar can't deal with people who don't treat him like the Second Coming.

[scruffycritter.livejournal.com]

No argument there. I'm just trying to give an accurate context. This thread got started alleging that Dubya had committed some type unwarranted attack upon the father of a vet. That's simply not the case (this time?).

I absolutely want him nailed to a cross for the crimes he commits, not the ones we think he has...otherwise we're no better than him.

[trdsf.livejournal.com]

Of course, who doesn't ultimately want them all home anyway? The Liar's reaction is just sad. He's really as detached from reality as we've always suspected, and at least now the media is paying attention. I can't wait for the wheel of history to turn. I have this lovely mental image of him at eighty or so, wondering why everyone hates him, still never understanding just how much damage he did to this country--or worse for him, that he does come to understand some day.

[siliconshaman.livejournal.com]

Sociopath

Read the definition.

[also, so very tempted to edit that entry adding (see G.W Bush)]

[tomreedtoon.livejournal.com]

Nobody noticed something amazing: this story actually got out.

They used to be covered up pretty completely, with Bill O'Reilly and Rush and the rest of the Whole Sick Crew covering up and demeaning the person who dared to insult Monkey Boy. Now the stories are getting airplay and notice outside the blogger world.

Maybe some powerful people are realizing what a mistake he is. Or maybe they're allowing him to take the blame at last, because the right wing is going to replace him with someone who follows the same beliefs but can perform beter in public (McCain, perhaps?).

[filkertom.livejournal.com]

Gaaaah. McCain. I will never trust McCain again. I've been trying very, very hard to think of a Republican politician I would trust, and I'm having trouble. And that does depress me, because, dammit, we are all in this together.

[tigertoy.livejournal.com]

The only Republican I could possibly trust today would be one that has renounced what the Republican party has become, like Jim Jeffords. (I don't actually know much of anything about Jeffords other than that he left the Republicans.)

[filkertom.livejournal.com]

Well, yeah. That makes him an Independent. Therefore, not Republican.

[scruffycritter.livejournal.com]

Lincoln Chafee?

Pro-Choice, Anti-War. Un-nominateable.

Alan Simpson, but he'd never run.

[unclelumpy.livejournal.com]

Why not Giuliani?
He's pro-gay and pro-abortion rights.

[filkertom.livejournal.com]

His fatally aggressive police department, his attempt to cut off funding to the Brooklyn Museum because he didn't like some of its art, his kicking Yasser Arafat out of the UN's 50th Anniversary celebration, and his general calculated how-can-I-make-them-like-me attitude. I literally don't think the guy can be trusted.

[unclelumpy.livejournal.com]

Okay, so he's a darker shade of grey, but at least he's not black [ie: the color, not the heritage].

Besides... Just once I'd like to see an italian President before I die.

[tigertoy.livejournal.com]

If I have to have a Republican, better Giuliani than most, but that's like saying if I have to have a body part chopped off, better my right pinky than my leg. I perceive him as saner on social issues than most Rs, but much too pro-business and ready to dance with them that brung him.

[twfarlan.livejournal.com]

My response:

"How's he doing? Well, he's in the middle of a war. No wonder you had to ask, you wouldn't know the first thing about what that's like. He's on the brink of death on a daily basis. You're on the brink of needing your glass refilled. How's that alcoholism coming along, by the way?"

[gpeefalt.livejournal.com]

Webb should have said: "He's dodging bullets and shrapnel in Hell, no thanks to you."

[twfarlan.livejournal.com]

Considering that Shrub avoided his turn in Hell by begging Daddy to find him a way out, I don't blame any parent of a soldier for treating Shrub like shit.

[wcg.livejournal.com]

One who apparently hasn't seen all of James Webb's boxing trophies.

Other than that, it just seems par for the course with GWB.

[smoooom.livejournal.com]

The father didn't actually answer the question. He said what He wanted, the question was how was his son doing? They are different.

[unclelumpy.livejournal.com]

"How is your son doing?"
"He'd like to come home."

Or is your experience at human conversation and interaction limited to your keyboard?

[smoooom.livejournal.com]

quote from Toms entry

Webb responded that he really wanted to see his son brought back home, said a person who heard about the exchange from Webb.

HE wanted to see HIS son home. It was NOT an answer to the question.

A simple "I'd rather not talk about it" would have been an answer, or He hates it over there, or He's thinking about going AWOL, or He doesn't say much in his letters.

And just so you know I talk a lot better than I type.

[unclelumpy.livejournal.com]

Maybe you should have spent less time studying English and more time studying Ethics.

[smoooom.livejournal.com]

It seems to me that you are suggesting that I have no ethics because it drives me nuts when politicians don't answer the question put to them. Drives me crazy when any one does it to tell the truth. Politicians and lawyers seem to have the market cornered on not answering the question put to them. It doesn't matter where they are from or their political leaning. I have not said at all that I support Bush or not. I don't have an opinion because first of all I'm a Canadian living in Canada and our troops are in Afganistan. I only know what the media feeds us, or what friends say. I had mixed emotions when Iraq was invaded and still do. Somehow I can't see that pulling out now will help the Iraqi government, Some one I asked about this said that the US should pull out because Iraq shouldn't have been invaded in the first place. I really don't get that, there is still a job to do, rebuilding for one thing, helping a fledgling government to train it's own police and soldiers. Just so you know I have friends with children in both Iraq and Afganistan, These kids are doing a tough job in a tough situation, they want a chance to finish what they started. If my Sons wanted to join the Army I wouldn't try and stop them, I'd worry about them and of course I'd want them home, but not at the expense of someone elses life or freedom. Our freedom was bought with the blood of my parents generation. At the very bottom of all of this that's what these wars are about, not terrorism, freedom. The freedom of Afganis or Iraqis to worship as they choose, with out having someone elses relgious views pushed on them. That freedom is the most precious thing our countries have, not every has it, but they do deserve it.

This has rambled all over the place, I know you're going to blast away at me, that's your right, you are entitled to your own opinion, just as I am entitled to mine.

[mstrhypno.livejournal.com]

For once, Monkey-boy actually asked a caring question, maybe. I didn't hear the TONE, mind you, but it SOUNDS like he was actually asking how the kid was holding up under the rigors of life out on the sharp edge, which actually seems almost - gasp! - compassionate.

But I often look at people in the better possible light, unless I'm in my paranoid mode, which I usually am when dealing with politicians when they are discussing POLICY. But this wasn't a policy issue, really.

It could have been one father asking another father how his son was holding up being in the combat zone.

However, it WAS insensitive of him to have asked it since he SENT the kid there under what now is pretty obviously false pretenses in the first place.

So I withdraw my initial comment. Monkey-boy STILL doesn't think things through before he opens his mouth.

And today, Colin Powell said that Iraq was in the middle of a civil war, too, adding his considerable military knowledge to the growing tide of sentiment that this is what's really going on over there.

So another Monkey-boy supporter has officially jumped the sinking ship of state and joined the side that's firing broadsides into the sinking hulk as she heads for the bottom...

[markbernstein.livejournal.com]

This is completely unrelated to Webb or Bush, but I'm sufficiently pissed off at the moment to simply say, here's The Evil Fucks, Part 3.

[signy1.livejournal.com]

Unbe-frigging-lievable. That is beyond filthy. I'm not even going to dignify most of that hateful tirade with a response, but I will say this.

The 'swearing on a Bible' thing isn't a law. It isn't even a required ritual. It's a custom George Washington started that's taken on a life of its own, and at least one president-- Taylor, I believe-- refused to do it on religious grounds.

[filkertom.livejournal.com]

I saw that. Vile. Not to mention illegal. Not that that ever seems to matter -- IOKIYAR, y'know.

[trdsf.livejournal.com]

Dennis Prager is the same git who recently had his ass handed to him by Sam Harris in a debate on atheism vs. theism.

[hitchkitty.livejournal.com]

What amuses me no end is that, by his own arguments:

Were the blogger elected to political office himself, in an alternate-history version of the United States with a long-standing tradition of swearing on the Quran, that he'd have no problem bowing to the will of the majority.


Now, as for me, if I were ever to take complete leave of my senses and run for political office, I'd ask to be sworn in with a copy of the Constitution and the Declaration of Independence. I am, technically, a Christian -- an Episcopalian, which doesn't seem to count, to some -- but elected officials are not charged with preserving, protecting, or defending the KJV against all enemies, foreign and domestic.

(Psst, Tom! Idea for a meme: what book or document would you take an oath of office on?)

[markbernstein.livejournal.com]

Well, well. Turns out he made the whole thing up.

[hitchkitty.livejournal.com]

I am shocked, shocked at the thought that a right-wing radio pundit might pull something out of his ass!

Shocked, I say!

[schol-r-lea.livejournal.com]

Actually, the law would not only allow him to swear upon the Q'ran, it would *demand* that he do so, given his particular convictions.

http://www.straightdope.com/classics/a1_145.html

As the link above explains, the law does not actually require any specific form for oaths of office or testimony; several have made such oaths without any specific scriptures at all, including President Zachary Taylor (his religious denomination forbade oaths by God and the Bible as being sacrilegious, IIRC). Alternate form of the oath exists which makes no reference to the supernatural or religious at all, and a number of luminaries - such as Oliver Wendell Holmes, Jr., one of the most respected Justices to sit on the Supreme Court - took this form, either because they were not religiously inclined, or to avoid what they saw as a conflict between their religious views and their governmental duties. Other forms of oath are used for Buddhists,

This has nothing to do with 'multiculturalism'; the principle in question has existed in common law since before the US was a nation. Rather, it is entirely based on the principle of requiring a binding oath. Courts have consistently allowed and even required that oaths be taken in the form the testifier accepts as binding; otherwise, the oath would be legally invalid. Existing common law precedent would *require* a Muslim to take their oath on the Q'ran, if that was what they held to be binding to them - just as several Mormon senators and representatives have chosen to swear by the Book of Mormon in the past, IIRC (though not all - the LDS *does* recognize the scriptural authority of the Bible after all, though only the editions authorized by their church would be considered 'correct').

As for the Scientologist example, it wouldn't matter; their position is that *no* oath given either by or to non-Scientologists is binding, period.

That having been said, Ellison's choice *is* political; as a Muslim, he should have no problem swearing by "The Book", as it is considered to be equally sacred to Muslims as the Q'ran is (though they hold a very different interpretation of Joshua Magus' significance from either the Christians or the Jews, and assert that Mohommad's laws supercede those of the earlier prophets). However, he could insist that it be an Arabic version of the Bible rather than an English language edition; many previous oathtakers have brought their own copy of their religion's scriptures rather than swear by an version that consider schismatic or heretical. I can't say whether Ellison would have gotten the flack that he has for this, if he'd chosen to take the oath that way, however.

[anansi133.livejournal.com]

I think it's still kind of easy to forget what this thing is, and think of it as a human being. It still walks, talks, and presumably eats and shits too. But it can't quite be called a human being, since it has no free will.

I think it's obvious that the 'leader of the free world' is a meat puppet. No transaction with this creature can be anything but scripted. And if it's not in the script, there is no response.

The horrifying part to me, isn't that an individual human can be this badly compromised, but that the machinary exists to do such a thing in the first place.