Dreams Of Noise

Depends on if they're in a "Free Speech Zone" or not.

Y'know it's sad, truly sad, that most of the sheeple didn't even comment on those things.

*shakes his head sadly*

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first time I heard that --how very apt!

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I REALLY REALLY HATE that term. Mostly because I've had it applied to me too many times for holding ideologically incorrect opinions. So now that's what I hear when someone says it: "They don't agree with my One True Way, so they must be sheep!"

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If you hold a different opinion you are almost certainly by definition NOT a sheep.

And those that are using it the way you describe are more often than not, from my personal observations, sheep themselves.

I was being very specific - sheeple are those of our race that follow blindly and without thought. Those that don't care to think or haven't been taught to.

I still wear the woll myself from time to time but at least now I question things whereas most people do not.

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filkertom.livejournal.com

I agree with this one. To me, the "sheeple" are the ones to whom you can show detailed, documented, incontrovertible evidence of Something Really Wrong, and they'll say, "Yes, but...". The most closed-minded are the ones who say, "Yes but Clinton/Kennedy/whoever did it, too", partly because their reflex to defend the Chimperor is so strong and partly because at least half the time whatever they say is in fact incorrect... but they believe it anyway.

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The "different opinion" that usually gets the appellation applied to me is that there is no good reason for J. Average Citizen to walk around packing in public, and a number of VERY good reasons for them not to. (Just to posit one likely scenario: J. Gunslinger comes across a crime in progress and shoots the mugger/rapist/whatever. Then the cops come around the corner, drawn by the sound of gunfire. What do they see? Someone down, and a man with a gun in his hand. What are they going to think is happening?) But apparently anyone who doesn't toe the right ideological line about public carry is "sheeple".

If you've ever used the term in that kind of context, then I'm talking about YOU.

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Drop the chip from your shoulder please - I was explaining my definition of sheeple not attacking you as such. No attack was mentioned or intended and I apologize if you took anything I said as such.

We're all entitled to our opinions and while I don't agree with all of them I will support people's right to have them.

And to point at your example - if you came to those beliefs honestly and by your own decisions then fine. Those that do not think but take their lead blindly from others that do - those are sheeple.

Once again - you have proven that you have at least _thought_ out some, or possibly all, of your position and viewpoint. You are not sheeple.

At the risk of irritating you I will pass on some advice I've learned over the years. Learn to laugh at people that don't share your opinion or share an opinion without thought. Pity them and treat them as you would a child because they do not KNOW. "You poor poor deluded fool. I pity you because you do not know enough to understand."

Subtle motivation is far more lasting than a brick to the head. If you openly oppose them with force they will only respond with force - it's the way the universe works. They will play the stubborn child to no end and resist any attempt to learn.

But if you nudge them in the right direction they just might have a chance.

Ever watch Futurama? The episode where Bender meets God? "If you do things right, people won't be sure you've done anything at all."

These people are having ideas beaten into their heads and thinking beated OUT of their heads. Arguing with them does nothing but frustrate you. Beating YOUR ideas into their heads is a hard task and will accomplish nothing in the end but a slave to your ideas. And if you're an honest and good, thinking, person that's the last thing you want. (In my opinion anyway.)

Oh, and not once did I say sheeple were worthless - far from it. They are the unawakened force that can push the lever to move the earth. But only if they are taught to think and understand.

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Sorry about the over-heated response. There are a couple of terms that just do that to me; this is one, and the other major one is people on childfree fora talking about "moos". (NB: I am childfree myself.) There is simply no explanation you can make, no context into which you can put either of those words, which will make me see them as in any way acceptable -- nor make me not think less of anyone who uses them; my brain slots them into the same category as "raghead" or "faggot". Not that I would expect you to care about my opinion, since you don't know me, but that's the way it is.

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Fair enough. I do not agree with you but as I said before I accept that our opinions differ and respect yours. Especially since it is carefully considered from what I glean from our conversation.

As for caring about you - I honestly care about people unless they give me reason not to. I found out a long time ago that it was pointless to spend time after time making gradient judgment after gradient judgment immediately the moment I met people.

It's tiring and a waste of my time and energy. Somewhere in my mind I've a medium amount of criteria that determines my opinion of if they are good or bad in the people I meet. It's instinctive for me now. I now assume people are good unless their actions prove otherwise.

Sometimes people prove that they are bad immediately - sometimes before I even meet the person. Such as seeing their effect on the people/things around them.

Sometimes it takes a long time for them to prove to me that they aren't good people. Just as long sometimes to prove that they are no longer bad. Sometimes there are shades of grey as well though I try and distinguish them afterward.

And yes, sometimes I get screwed.

But in my book nothing else is a worthwhile path.

So yes - bizarre as it may sound I care about you after a fashion even though I don't really know you.

As an aside could you please give me a link for the definition of "moos" in the context of our discussion? I've never heard it before?

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I'm not sure there is an actual definition anywhere. Google "childfree moo" and you'll get an earful of context.

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*googles*

Got it! Definitions 3, 4, and 5 in the Urban Dictionary (http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=moo)

And FWIW I agree with your anger at this term.

While motherhood may not be for everyone it shouldn't be put down. And a mother who can't properly raise her kids has other problems almost certainly and needs help not insults. The "moo" thing seems to be just another bad judgment by people. :-(

I just wish there were some way to make people care more about other people. It's an impossibility I know but I can't help thinking that there's got to be something better than what we're doing...

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devospice.livejournal.com

This whole situation is following Episode III with creepy similarities.

The good news is if he hasn't made himself emperor by in the next year and a half we could actually stand a chance of getting rid of him.

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the-s-guy.livejournal.com

Using Diebold voting machines?

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Actually I suggest you go watch all of B5 from start to finish. You'll find that it's eerily creepy how most of the political situations fit our current situation in the US. I'm not joking about this either - check it out for yourself.

I just hope it doesn't get to the armed rebellion stage.

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chaosdancer.livejournal.com

Goodness, do you think this is why you can't find B5 reruns anywhere? /bats eyes innocently

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Gaah! Leave my tinfoil alone! It's thick enough as it is....

*blink*

*goes to get more tinfoil*

Tongue only slightly in cheek. ;-)

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morpheus0013.livejournal.com

Uh...*slinks over and stands in front of B5 DVD collection, one wary eye on the door*

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chaosdancer.livejournal.com

You're still using tinfoil, laddie? In these parts we drink pure molten vanadium with a tungsten chaser every morning at breakfast. That way *nothing* gets in!

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I'm middle class. Tinfoil is all I can afford. ;-)

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scifantasy.livejournal.com

"I just wanted to tell you that I'm a big science fiction fan, and that Babylon 5 is the best science fiction television series *ever*."

--Karl Rove to Bruce Boxleitner (http://worldsofjms.com/usenet/post/021126a.htm).

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This explains much...

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randwolf.livejournal.com

I don't think this is even constitutional; it's a direct attack on what, theoretically, is one of the defenses of the Federal system. In practice, of course, that defense never worked as designed. Still...

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wcg.livejournal.com

Woodrow Wilson did this in 1917. The current laws are a result of backlash against Wilson's drafting the entire National Guard for service in France, leaving many states with nobody for natural disaster coverage.

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sunfell.livejournal.com

Our governor has his hackles up about this, and he's the president of the National Governor's Association.

This is a very bad idea, trying to go around state governors to federalize state military units. Very bad.

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valarltd.livejournal.com

*headdesk*

Let's combine this with the new anti-terrorism act that is so broad reporters who write negative article are "terrorists" and some Halliburton-built "relocation camps" (used in times of emergency or national disaster).

Y'know? I don't think I'm writing dystopian fiction anymore. I think I'm prescient.

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palenoue.livejournal.com

If anything, handing the national guard to Bush would make natural disasters worse. Instead of governors calling them in next disaster, Bush's people will have them camping out in hotels miles away doing nothing but waiting for the next photo-op (remember the firefighter volunteers during Katrina?)

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emiofbrie.livejournal.com

At least there is some comfort in the fact that on the 29th the media will be reminding us about the government fiasco that was Hurricane Katrina (being the first anniversary of the disaster)...hopefully that will remind even more people why the Bushies and his friends in Congress suck so much, and right before Congressional campaigns shift into high gear too...

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capplor.livejournal.com

as much of the link as I could stomach to read claimed that Katrina was why they wanted to power grab (never mind that at least part of the problem was an incompetent federal official).

Doublethink lives, and 1984 came approximately 20 years later.

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emiofbrie.livejournal.com

But simply seeing the destruction images will remind people of what happened, and of how much the Feds fucked up...

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If the American people were going to call Bush and his gang of monsters on blatant power grabs, they would have done it before now. I think he (or whoever does his thinking for him) keeps upping the stakes 'cause you people aren't calling their bluff.

Here's an interesting piece from a whole other perspective:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gFrH91f2-CI

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Checking the link above, I find that it includes only the first minute of what i saw only two days ago as a six-minute video. I tried really hard to find the longer version but couldn't.

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morpheus0013.livejournal.com

I think "you people aren't calling his bluff" is disingenuous. Some of us can and do call his bluffsn as loud and long as we can.

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I know some of you are, and I thank the gods for you. But I seethe with impotent rage here on the sidelines ... sometimes it feels as if this whole new chapter in American foreign policy is a nightmare, aren't you the folks who made 'freedom' and 'democracy' popular as ideals world-wide?

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filkertom.livejournal.com

Well, see, that's exactly the problem. Many, many people have been calling the Misadministration out on this for years... and they blithely ignore it and continue to break the law and kill people and enrich their donors and cronies. I would in no way be a good president... but if I could have one day as supreme ruler of the US, I'd do a whole lot of stuff that would have the Republicans frothing, the first two of which would be to [a] turn BushCo en masse over to The Hague and [b] publicly apologize to the world for our country's illegal actions.

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